different 30 WCF ammo

[Mike in tx]

I just read about Buffalo Bore's new 190 grain bullet for 30 WCF. It sounds good and I may try to get hold of some. Go to their website and look for 28A 30-30 ammo. At 150 yards it drops, IIRC, 1.2 inches from a 0 at muzzle. I could be wrong in that so am looking for confirmation. Sounds like a good black bear load.

[versifier]

Why shoot a 190gr bullet in a .30-30 when a 150 has a flatter trajectory, longer effective range, and will kill a black bear just as quickly and cleanly? Penetration is as much a function of the shape of the bullet's nose and a flat meplat transfers much more energy. You want to anchor a black bear with your first shot into the front shoulder. A well placed 150 will do that with a lot less recoil. If you really need the abuse, I have three different 180-190gr moulds (311041, RCBS 180FN, and .30Ranch Dog), but I seldom load them in .30-30's for hunting unless the rifle really likes them best. My friends who hunt bear with .30-30's use my 150FNGC's (designed by "45 2.1" from Cast Boolits), but Lee's 150FNGC works equally well. And they work well on moose, too, though in all honesty for anything over 400lbs I'm happier with something more than a .30-30, and a heavier bullet. But for deer and black bear, why bother?

Jacketed bullets like the ones in Buffalo Bore's ammo (or any others) give you no advantage at all at .30-30 velocities. In my not very humble opinion, they are a waste of both copper and hard earned money. An extra thirty grains of bullet weight is far less a factor than correct placement, and I am a lot more likely to place a bullet better with a load that recoils about half as much in a light lever rifle and shoots flatter.

[Mike in tx]

I agree with you Mr.V but I like to try out different things. I have almost always used 150 grain in the 30 WCF and been happy but I like the thrill of the unknown. Hope deer season is good for you this year.

[versifier]

Far be it for me to stifle innovation. Or get in the way of natural selection. Bears have to eat, too.

I almost choked when I read in their promo literature about how it made the .30-30 suitable for hunting grizzlies and cape buffalo. Santa needs to bring those boys some serious meds. You can kill them with a rock, too, but that doesn't make it a smart idea.

I do think that bullet has some real potential in the larger .30's for big game, even dangerous game. Too bad they don't sell it as a component. Being a cup&core, I doubt they would out penetrate a 180RN NOS PAR, but if a rifle really shoots them accurately, why not? They ought to perform as well as similar Rem and Sierra 180gr RNSP offerings. Especially for someone who doesn't hand load and needs to give a rifle as many choices as possible.

[j1]

Right on v. Every animal living in north america has been killed by the 22 long rifle too, but not by me.

[Kirbydoc]

http://www.angelfire.com/on2/LandOwn...s/GRIZLEY2.JPG

[versifier]

OMFG. You do what you have to do. If all you have is a pea shooter, you might as well go down shooting peas as peeing and trying to run. At the butcher shop they kill full grown cattle with a .22 short right between the eyes. Never seen them need a second shot. But I wouldn't want to try to kill a big bear from that close with one.

Or a .30-30 by choice on anything that large and dangerous, no matter how heavy a bullet you load in it. Some of those 190gr bullets or some NOS PAR's or Barnes copper solids in a .308 or an -06 or one of the big mags would suit me better. And some yardage between us, too. 1-200yds wouldn't hurt my feelings a bit.

Even a small black bear is nothing you want to tangle with up close unless you have no other choice, at least 50yds is nice so you have time for more shots. A well placed .30-30 bullet will kill a 400lb black bear, but you never shoot just one at something that can and will kill you if you really piss it off instead of killing it cleanly. Always shoot a bear with at least three rounds and reload before approaching it. Around here you follow up a wounded bear with a 12ga pump, slugs and buckshot, but I won't do it willingly. I don't hunt them. Hate the taste of the meat, only the hottest chili hides that taste from me. I much prefer venison or moose or partridge.

[Kirbydoc]

Yeah, she's pretty handy with that rifle.

[Kirbydoc]

Hey Versifier, I bet you would get your cardiac exercise for the day though wouldn't ya?

[Hellrazor]

I know of a old fart who tagged a large black bear with a 22WMR and it didn't make it 40 yards. Teaches it to growl and mock charge someone holding a rifle. Stingers are awesome..

I still stand by my - I will hunt any NA game with my 243.